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| Agrippina |
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 | ajandval wrote ... Hi all, As Valarie & I continue to learn more and more about the breed, we seem to notice some misconceptions about Neos in general. I would like to pose this question under the assumption that the buyer has researched the breeder and the line of their puppy, so the family health history of the line is good to go. Is there more we can do as owners as far as diet, screenings, exercise, etc. to help ensure our Neos have the best oppurtunity to live to their fullest potential and hopefully have a longer lifespan. I understand that there are no "silver bullet" answers here, and that what may have worked for some will or did not work for others. My intention is to open a forum from where my family and/or others may learn. Thank you, Anthony Nope, there is no "silver bullet" so to say. There are things breeders can do in general- educate their buyers and BE HONEST. There are plenty of things buyers can do, but that is a whole book on responsibility that no one here wants to hear! We need to start doing more, in all reality. Hips, hearts, thyroids, ect. All need to be checked before breeding. Will it start when buyers start demanding the results? I don't know, but too many dogs are dropping dead at 4 yrs old. Why is this? Also- temperament. Some will say I'm crazy, a few will agree, but we really need to be more concerned with it. Breeding "Filtered Word" cats that will run away from a threat is not in the best interest of this breed. Mastini are guard dogs- so why breed dogs that won't "guard". And the truth of it all is- you really truly don't know what a dog will do until you test them! Our dogs need more stamina. More drive. I don't want a dog that gets winded after a 20 min walk. I don't want a fragile thing that I am afraid to take on a long walk for fear of the dog hurting himself. There are huge differences between what the "show" people think is right and what the "working" people think is right. What happened to somewhere in the middle? I want functional, healthy Neapolitan Mastiffs that LOOK like Neapolitan Mastiffs! Overdone slobs are not for me. On the other hand- I like type. To me, overdone is just as bad as not enough.  More later after I haven't worked for 4 days straight with 4 or 5 hrs sleep a night..... _________________________ Nikki Agrippina Mastino | |||
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| Kate |
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 | Why do we do that in the show ring? Show dogs that are considered " standard", but in reality don't always, or shouldn't exist...I have shepherds and a lab. And when I watched the Westminster I must say I was appauled at what I saw...The labs were all just down right fat (I had heard how big they can be, but hadn't seen it yet). I could not picture any of them running in a field or crashing through water. The shepherds I have seen before in show...The slopping of the hip is scary, but is starting to straighten out (slowly but surely). This is really the reason I have never shown in the conformation ring...What I see as " standard" tends to be far different. I think I would be laughed out !mistrust I enjoy very much doing agility, frisbee, tracking, dock diving, rally-o, obedience, etc. I think competing in these shows / trials is far more rewarding and practical for my dogs and what I expect out of them...I hopefully am raising healthy, fit, and happy dogs that will last to their top potential. [ Edited Sun Mar 23 2008, 01:28AM ] Kate and the zoo \"Shit happens.\" | |||
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| Kate |
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| | I would like to add that today at the All About Pets Show I was paid a compliment of sorts...One of the breeders at the show really admired Sirus and thought he was a great looking dog, and commented that she had never seen one that had "normal" legs. I didn't quite understand, until she went on to explain that all the dogs she has seen (in show probably) have had twisted looking legs (I am assuming she meant the way so many have the turning out or in of the feet...not sure if this is standard or not). Kate and the zoo \"Shit happens.\" | |||
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| lynnicks |
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 | Well you are doing exactly what I enjoy with my dogs and I think it is great to have fit dogs not lumps of Lard. As for the feet turning in or out I dont think it is supposed to be a good thing but many dogs are having this problem and maybe a person who shows can answer that question better for you. Love your smiling picture really makes me smile everytime I see it | |||
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| Anthony |
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 | Agrippina wrote ... [/quote1206244156] Nope, there is no "silver bullet" so to say. There are things breeders can do in general- educate their buyers and BE HONEST. There are plenty of things buyers can do, but that is a whole book on responsibility that no one here wants to hear! We need to start doing more, in all reality. Hips, hearts, thyroids, ect. All need to be checked before breeding. Will it start when buyers start demanding the results? I don't know, but too many dogs are dropping dead at 4 yrs old. Why is this? Also- temperament. Some will say I'm crazy, a few will agree, but we really need to be more concerned with it. Breeding "Filtered Word" cats that will run away from a threat is not in the best interest of this breed. Mastini are guard dogs- so why breed dogs that won't "guard". And the truth of it all is- you really truly don't know what a dog will do until you test them! Our dogs need more stamina. More drive. I don't want a dog that gets winded after a 20 min walk. I don't want a fragile thing that I am afraid to take on a long walk for fear of the dog hurting himself. There are huge differences between what the "show" people think is right and what the "working" people think is right. What happened to somewhere in the middle? I want functional, healthy Neapolitan Mastiffs that LOOK like Neapolitan Mastiffs! Overdone slobs are not for me. On the other hand- I like type. To me, overdone is just as bad as not enough. More later after I haven't worked for 4 days straight with 4 or 5 hrs sleep a night..... Yeah Nikki, we have noticed that too many terrific Mastini seem to have passed before their time. I'm sure there are many more that live long productive lives. We will just do our best to ensure Beau and future Kyle Neos are properly care for and respected. As for the breeding aspect. Checked out Dr Allen's book from an interlibrary loan program here in York County they reserved for us...great read and hard to put down. I know that reading this book by no means makes me an expert, but in it she mentions that some of today's breeders have gotten away from the standard of the old world. In that they are trying to separate the companion from the worker in the breed for the show ring and the increasing numbers of families wanting them as pets. This varies from country to country, and was also written before the AKC recognized Neos so it is a bit dated, but does shed some light on how different tastes can influence the breed as a whole. My tastes are similar to yours so I will always try to linebreed or outcross with lines to match the desired outcome of those like Gas and Ronny's kennel. I guess what I'm really trying to say that your point about the breeders have a responsibility to ensure their product adheres to the working or old world standard is right on in my book. Anthony <script type="text/javascript"><!-- google_ad_client = "pub-8540005283325832"; /* 728x90, created 17/04/09 */ google_ad_slot = "0692574383"; google_ad_width = 728; google_ad_height = 90; //--> </script> <script type="text/javascript" src="http://pagead2.googlesyndication.com/pagead/show_ads.js"> </script> | |||
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| Agrippina |
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| | The neo of today really in no way looks like the mastino of old. There are definite similarities seen in some examples though. Pay close attention to older head shapes. Yes, Dr. Allen's book is a bit dated, but in some ways still true today and really corresponds with my first post in that some people (working people) want that 'old style' dog. Most show people tend to like more heavily wrinkled dogs. Heavily wrinkled being a modern creation. The working crowd thinks these heavily wrinkled dogs aren't any good- get winded, breathing problems, no endurance, ect. I tend to sit in the middle and want more functional dogs with SOME wrinkle. _________________________ Nikki Agrippina Mastino | |||
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| Jamesjuile |
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 | Kate, the feet turning out thing is quite standard and/or normal. Not quite 'ten to two' feet but definitely not forward facing. Twists within the front legs sounds more like ulnar osteomyosis and ulitimately, unless operated on and corrected will end up in lameness that will see the dog put down. The ulnar snaps!! Very nasty!!! And as for type, I have quite a mix and enjoy them all for different reasons. julie Home of Whitelabel mastini It is better to die on your feet than to live on your knees. | |||
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| Anthony |
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| | Agrippina wrote ... The neo of today really in no way looks like the mastino of old. There are definite similarities seen in some examples though. Pay close attention to older head shapes. Yes, Dr. Allen's book is a bit dated, but in some ways still true today and really corresponds with my first post in that some people (working people) want that 'old style' dog. Most show people tend to like more heavily wrinkled dogs. Heavily wrinkled being a modern creation. The working crowd thinks these heavily wrinkled dogs aren't any good- get winded, breathing problems, no endurance, ect. I tend to sit in the middle and want more functional dogs with SOME wrinkle. Thanks Nikki, you're right. I mis-spoke/typed. There are distinct differences. Anthony Anthony <script type="text/javascript"><!-- google_ad_client = "pub-8540005283325832"; /* 728x90, created 17/04/09 */ google_ad_slot = "0692574383"; google_ad_width = 728; google_ad_height = 90; //--> </script> <script type="text/javascript" src="http://pagead2.googlesyndication.com/pagead/show_ads.js"> </script> | |||
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| Anthony |
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| | Nikki, as is "mis-spoke/typed", meant to say that I was flat out wrong, and thanks for the correction. Don't want to be a politician here. Anthony <script type="text/javascript"><!-- google_ad_client = "pub-8540005283325832"; /* 728x90, created 17/04/09 */ google_ad_slot = "0692574383"; google_ad_width = 728; google_ad_height = 90; //--> </script> <script type="text/javascript" src="http://pagead2.googlesyndication.com/pagead/show_ads.js"> </script> | |||
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| Kate |
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| | OW! Ulnar snaps x) Maybe this is what she was seeing? Good to know about the feet...I don't have to freak out if I see it in my boy Kate and the zoo \"Shit happens.\" | |||
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